Topological Naming Issue: any news?

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Shalmeneser
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by Shalmeneser »

ppemawm wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 12:56 am The TPM issue can be avoided if you simply learn to attach sketches to origin planes rather than the model itself. If you have to refer to the model, reference the sketch that created the feature. At least it is one step removed from the TPM problem.

In my humble experience TPM is not a day-to-day problem except for dress-up features such as chamfers, fillets, thickness, etc. but even those can be minimized or easily repaired if you include them in sketches or early or late as possible in the tree.
+1
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BartR
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by BartR »

Shalmeneser wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:46 am @BartR : can you provide your file ?
Please

https://drive.google.com/file/d/11_2rCf ... sp=sharing

In the feature "Support" try to ad a thread.

you will get issues on the Additive pipes as well as on the Fillets and Chamfers :-/
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by Shalmeneser »

1) Should not set dimensions on fillet vertex in a sketch (eg. Outer001). You should be able to modify the fillet radius without modifying anything else
2) Where is your origin ??? Do not hide it.
3) Inner sketch is too complex. (use PartDesign_Mirroredat least.)
4) SupportBraketHoles sketch should be on a plane to pe pocketed with symmetry.
5) Why some sketches have no Map Mode or Support ? (trying to avoid TNP with losing something else ?)
6) Pocket_R should be a mirror
7) Fascia should be done like 4)
8) HoleScrews like 4)
9) Mesh Guide SubtractivePipe should not use edges : TNP, but Outer001 sketch for profile !
10) Additive pipe : mirror or linearPattern ?
11) DatumPlane010 support is LAST SOLID : TNP² : solid = bad but last solid = the worst. (the more upstream your reference is, the less TNP prone your model is).
12) Bottom fillet should done as 2nd feature in the construction tree !
13) Blumlein Chamfer could be done with Pocket_L with a groove (no TNP).
14) Do threaded holes last or never use anything from the solid.
15) You never use Expressions ; not really parametric !
16) Depth of Logo could be constant.
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BartR
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by BartR »

Shalmeneser wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 1:02 pm 1) Should not set dimensions on fillet vertex in a sketch (eg. Outer001). You should be able to modify the fillet radius without modifying anything else
2) Where is your origin ??? Do not hide it.
3) Inner sketch is too complex. (use PartDesign_Mirroredat least.)
4) SupportBraketHoles sketch should be on a plane to pe pocketed with symmetry.
5) Why some sketches have no Map Mode or Support ? (trying to avoid TNP with losing something else ?)
6) Pocket_R should be a mirror
7) Fascia should be done like 4)
8) HoleScrews like 4)
9) Mesh Guide SubtractivePipe should not use edges : TNP, but Outer001 sketch for profile !
10) Additive pipe : mirror or linearPattern ?
11) DatumPlane010 support is LAST SOLID : TNP² : solid = bad but last solid = the worst. (the more upstream your reference is, the less TNP prone your model is).
12) Bottom fillet should done as 2nd feature in the construction tree !
13) Blumlein Chamfer could be done with Pocket_L with a groove (no TNP).
14) Do threaded holes last or never use anything from the solid.
15) You never use Expressions ; not really parametric !
16) Depth of Logo could be constant.
On Additive/Subtractive Pipes: when the path is asked, I select line by line and those are named Edges. I don't know any other way, since I learned these in tutorials, they do the same. So, when FreeCAD renames the edges, also these are renamed and all the references are lost and the feature is messed up.

yes right I'm not using so often expressions. But I don't see (for my illiteracy) the advantage to use parametrizations in this context.
If you give me an example I can better understand it and apply it for sure

EDIT: I found now how to do it, just by selecting the sketch as Object.
Last edited by BartR on Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by BartR »

Note:

I left many features independent to each other (no mirroring) because it's possible in the future they will differ in something (different diameters or thickness, anything).

yes some sketch has not any support, trying to avoid TNP. I just chosen for the axis (XY vs XZ vs YZ) and then reposition it if occurred.

DatumPlane010: I didn't want i ton the last solid. Thanks for the highlight. I wanted it on just XZ. I corrected it now without beg impacts.
The same for the Subtractive Mesh

About Bottom Fillet and Blumlein Chamfer: I applied them at the end, because all what I got on forum and tutorials was "keep these things at the very end of the object". Perhaps I misunderstood something, but to me the very end of the object it means: when I finished to add all the features I need.

unfortunately I can't apply this now. It's too late.

Depth of the Logo is is ok as it is. Indeed the surface is rounded but the Logo (it's a Badge I make), is flat. So the depth can't be constant
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by Shalmeneser »

BartR wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 1:08 pm 1) On Additive/Subtractive Pipes: when the path is asked, I select line by line and those are named Edges. I don't know any other way, since I learned these in tutorials, they do the same. So, when FreeCAD renames the edges, also these are renamed and all the references are lost and the feature is messed up.

2) yes right Im' not using so foten expressions. But I don't see (for my illiteracy) the advantage to use parametrizations in this context.
If you give me an example I can better understand it and apply it for sure
1) When you want to select a path, you can select objects from the 3D-view (solid or sketch lines) or sketch from the construction tree.
A whole sketch is always better (or a Binder).

2) Each time you use twice the same dimension, there is a problem if you need to modify this dimension : you need to change it EVERYWHERE.
If you give a name to this 1st dimension in a sketch, you can refere to it later :

Code: Select all

sketchXXX.constraints.NAME_OF_DIMENSION
The same for dimension from a feature :

Code: Select all

PadXXX.length
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by Shalmeneser »

BartR wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 1:37 pm 1) yes some sketch has not any support, trying to avoid TNP. I just chosen for the axis (XY vs XZ vs YZ) and then reposition it if occurred.
2) DatumPlane010: I didn't want it on the last solid. Thanks for the highlight. I wanted it on just XZ. I corrected it now without beg impacts.
The same for the Subtractive Mesh
3) About Bottom Fillet and Blumlein Chamfer: I applied them at the end, because all what I got on forum and tutorials was "keep these things at the very end of the object". Perhaps I misunderstood something, but to me the very end of the object it means: when I finished to add all the features I need.
3) unfortunately I can't apply this now. It's too late.
4) Depth of the Logo is is ok as it is. Indeed the surface is rounded but the Logo (it's a Badge I make), is flat. So the depth can't be constant
1) :evil:
2) Try to select on the construction tree, avoiding features but prefer sketches or axis.
3) For a TNP feature (fillet, chamfer, thickness), either you do it first or last.
First to have minimum upstream other features and less reason to be victim of TNP.
Last to accept TNP.
4) for a constant thickness : cut too much then repad :
* flat and profound pocket
* pad of the round face with an offset = thickness
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by BartR »

Shalmeneser wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:39 pm
BartR wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 1:37 pm 1) yes some sketch has not any support, trying to avoid TNP. I just chosen for the axis (XY vs XZ vs YZ) and then reposition it if occurred.
2) DatumPlane010: I didn't want it on the last solid. Thanks for the highlight. I wanted it on just XZ. I corrected it now without beg impacts.
The same for the Subtractive Mesh
3) About Bottom Fillet and Blumlein Chamfer: I applied them at the end, because all what I got on forum and tutorials was "keep these things at the very end of the object". Perhaps I misunderstood something, but to me the very end of the object it means: when I finished to add all the features I need.
3) unfortunately I can't apply this now. It's too late.
4) Depth of the Logo it is ok as it is. Indeed the surface is rounded but the Logo (it's a Badge I make), is flat. So the depth can't be constant
1) :evil:
2) Try to select on the construction tree, avoiding features but prefer sketches or axis.
3) For a TNP feature (fillet, chamfer, thickness), either you do it first or last.
First to have minimum upstream other features and less reason to be victim of TNP.
Last to accept TNP.
4) for a constant thickness : cut too much then repad :
* flat and profound pocket
* pad of the round face with an offset = thickness
1) I watched it in a tutorial, then I used it. That's the thing
2) yes I fortunately was able to correct it.
3) I recognize it's not easy stuff to keep under control when you are designing, but I think it's all matter of experience. And I need to build it up more.
I will follow your advice.
4) Offset + Thickness?
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Shalmeneser
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by Shalmeneser »

:idea:
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Re: Topological Naming Issue: any news?

Post by BartR »

Shalmeneser wrote: Sun Feb 05, 2023 3:53 pm:idea:
Ah ok thank you for the tip.
I tired to apply it, considering also the suggestions you gave me about the Parameters. It worked.
Unfortunately the features are not in the ideal order, into the Tree View.
But thanks to your help guys, I learned more things.

in the future I will apply what I learned here trying to minimize the TNP.

Often issues are not while you make the first version of the object, but when you need to apply some modification to it.
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