[announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

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adrianinsaval
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by adrianinsaval »

wsteffe wrote: Mon Feb 06, 2023 2:06 pm
John doesn't know the FreeCAD source. That isn't his expertise. Instead, he would prepare a plan and keep us all going in the same direction to get the work done.
It reminds to me the old adage "Who knows does, who doesn't know teaches". :lol:
this is a completely unfair comparison, john is just joining in, can't expect somebody new to know it all already. (not to mention how this saying is in general a word censored one)
GeneFC wrote: Mon Feb 06, 2023 4:07 pm This entire topic has become nothing more than a gripe session with various personal attacks thrown in. I have not seen anything related to "testing" for many weeks.

Completely non-productive.

Just about time to shut it down.

Gene
I don't think shutting this down is the best approach... some of the points are fair, starting over from scratch again is IMO a fair criticism of the apparent new plan, requests for better explanations are fair, specially now that we are entering on the territory of people getting paid to do this stuff
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by wsteffe »

adrianinsaval wrote: Tue Feb 07, 2023 2:25 pm this is a completely unfair comparison, john is just joining in, can't expect somebody new to know it all already.
I would agree with you if the quoted post were saying:
John doesn't know the FreeCAD source. That isn't his expertise... therefore he will examine the TPN problem and the RT algorithms trying to define a realistic development/integration roadmap.
Instead it was just saying:
"John doesn't know the FreeCAD source. That isn't his expertise... therefore he will prepare a plan and keep us all going in the same direction to get the work done".
I do not want to underestimate John (who is welcome) but I think that the TPN problem is quite complex and I wouldn't take for granted that things can follow straightforward as suggested.
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adrianinsaval
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by adrianinsaval »

wsteffe wrote: Tue Feb 07, 2023 3:53 pm I would agree with you if the quoted post were saying:
John doesn't know the FreeCAD source. That isn't his expertise... therefore he will examine the TPN problem and the RT algorithms trying to define a realistic development/integration roadmap.
Instead it was just saying:
"John doesn't know the FreeCAD source. That isn't his expertise... therefore he will prepare a plan and keep us all going in the same direction to get the work done".
I do not want to underestimate John (who is welcome) but I think that the TPN problem is quite complex and I wouldn't take for granted that things can follow straightforward as suggested.
just above that chennes had written:
John (a professional software developer with many years of experience) has been working on reviewing real thunder's branch in depth. He presented a plan to re-sort and break up the complete branch into 20-30 functional steps. He intends to present a schedule and Gannt chart in a forum thread in the coming weeks
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by likeacad »

From https://github.com/orgs/Ondsel-Developm ... cussions/1:
Just curious were also the previous efforts discussed? Like this: first version of Toponaming is ready for testing . Simple yes or no would fit. ;) I hope the answer will be yes. I waiting for years to jump back to vanilla version.
sliptonic:
Yes. We discussed it (a lot). The post you linked to refers to the work done in the toponaming branch. They did some really great work to clean things up. But here's the problem: The branch represents 95 commits forward with toponaming but is almost 2500 commits behind master! Before it could be merged, it would have to be rebased on master and that's another huge effort. By the time the rebase is done, it will be hundreds or thousands of commits behind again. You run in place and never catch up. That's why I think the current approach is problematic.

Instead of trying to get the whole thing ready to merge at once, we need to carve out pieces that can be merged to master immediately without breaking it. Those first merges may not add anything useful but we can build on them without eternally rebasing. It's going to take some time but it is achievable.
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Zolko
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by Zolko »

wsteffe wrote: Tue Feb 07, 2023 3:53 pm I do not want to underestimate John (who is welcome) but I think that the TPN problem is quite complex and I wouldn't take for granted that things can follow straightforward as suggested.
and yet his suggestion during FOSDEM was – in my opinion – spot on. Much closer to a workable solution than previous proposals.

"I'll read RT's TNP source code and break it up unto small pieces to be merged into FreeCAD Master "

–vs–

"Lets' integrate also RT's PartDesign work and merge everything into FreeCAD Master "
try the Assembly4 workbench for FreCAD — tutorials here and here
IPowIPi
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by IPowIPi »

If the core team agrees that the TPN patch is the most important new feature of FreeCAD 1.0, wouldn't it be worth a consideration to freeze the FreeCAD core and PartDesign code, rebase one more time, fully review, document, refactor - do whatever is necessary. to have a good feeling that this is sustainable, then merge, then unlock again?
I know this is not how a bazar works, but if you have to add a new feature of cathedralic proportions then such a measure might be justified (and perhaps even necessary)?
likeacad
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by likeacad »

Based on this blog post: https://ondsel.com/blog/freecad-topological-naming we can follow the progress of the topic in GitHub issue here: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/issues/8432
For more context and to follow developments as we work on breaking down and gradually merging RealThunder’s fix, subscribe to the GitHub issue.
berniev
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by berniev »

IPowIPi
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by IPowIPi »

Fingers crossed that this works out! I guess at this point there is a whole bunch of people (including me) that would be happy with a new FreeCAD version with the TNP mitigation as the only new feature for one year.
(I think many features of FreeCAD are really great! But if there is an issue serious enough to not use the software for bigger projects it doesn't help to add additional great features - it still won't be used.)
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Re: [announcement] first version of Toponaming is ready for testing

Post by aapo »

I feel that it'd be helpful to post here the Good News for those who don't follow the GitHub process very closely. Today, I noticed that the first actual Toponaming commits have actually landed into the FreeCAD master! So it's not just a separate toponaming branch any more, great! https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/comm ... 9f8dd16af4

There's quite a long discussion about the process in https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/issues/8432, and this already merged part seems to be the part 1 of 4 of the preliminary stuff. So, this does not actually fix anything yet, even after 4 of 4 merged, but it lays the foundations for the Toponaming algorithm to be included into the FreeCAD master. So, as far as I understand, the inclusion of Toponaming branch to the FreeCAD Master has finally really begun! Congratulations to the developers for this important step!

So, it seems realthunder's algorithm has finally started its way to FreeCAD proper, but please see also this to understand it'll take quite some time to be fully incorporated: https://ondsel.com/blog/freecad-topolog ... ntPgNMmUGA
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