[Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

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openBrain
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by openBrain »

Zolko wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 9:21 am Did you experiment with other panel layouts ? Did you experiment with other workbenches and tasks ?

Put it simply: forget about this, please stop messing around with things that work well and have been working well for years.
Be constructive. What problems did you see or anticipate ?
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Zolko
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by Zolko »

openBrain wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 9:36 am What problems did you see or anticipate ?
in my layout, the tree-view is separate on the left, and the task-panel is superposed with the property panel, and the tab is on the bottom, your button wouldn't have anywhere to go :

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Also, standard Python task-panels have standard pre-defined buttons for Close/Cancel/... in the task-panel.
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by drmacro »

Zolko wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 9:21 am ...
Put it simply: forget about this, please stop messing around with things that work well and have been working well for years.
The point is they don't work well.

Having the three buttons at the bottom is in almost every case cutting off the Ok button. In Check geometry, the right most button is almost always cut off. And requires scrolling right to get it...of course that is after scrolling down to find it.

When a panel is scrolled so the completion buttons are out of sight, you need to guess, do I scroll up? or down? Or, have muscle memory with that particular panel.

Having a specific panel for a bunch of different tasks means the layout need to be defined. I.e. if it the "task" is displayed in the Task panel the completion buttons need to be in the same place...put them at the top or the bottom but not both randomly.

While I, for one, think a lot of the "UI is <insert your favorite complaint here>" comments are superfluous, this sort of whimsical placement of completion buttons is one where I agree, it makes FC appear be assembled from IKEA instructions that got rained on.
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openBrain
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by openBrain »

Zolko wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:01 am in my layout
Ok, so your first post was a centric answer.
Maybe you missed the fact I proposed this as an optional alternative.
So, if my rationale is correct, your point of view actually is "I don't care as long as it is an option"
Also, standard Python task-panels have standard pre-defined buttons for Close/Cancel/... in the task-panel.
I guess you don't know how it internally works.
But you don't need.
Maybe to be more clear, the proposed alternative would "move" the buttons of the task dialog to the tab bar.
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by Grub »

Some software have buttons OK/Cancel inside 3D View, It saves space and has a fixed location
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by wmayer »

They sometimes are at the bottom, sometimes at the top of the dialog
Usually the OK/Cancel/Close buttons are on the bottom of a dialog. Putting them on top was done for large task dialogs to avoid that the user has to always scroll to the bottom. But if it's considered a problem that it sometimes is at the top and sometimes at the bottom then we put the all to the top.
They tend to disappear on large dialogs where you need to scroll
A possibility could be to only embed the task dialog into a scroll area and make sure that the button box is always visible.
Always accessible (if task dialog is scrolled, or even if hidden by tree view)
I am not sure if this is an advantage. If the buttons are visible but not the task dialog the user doesn't see what he accepts/rejects.
They take a significant amount of space
Another issue that should be considered:
Currently the combo view has two tabs and there were times when it had three. So, it's good possible that in the future there will be more tabs again. And since the Check geometry dialog was mentioned it has four buttons. So, if now the buttons are added to the tab bar it can happen that the whole combo view takes a lot of extra width in order to show everything.
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by openBrain »

wmayer wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:51 am But if it's considered a problem that it sometimes is at the top and sometimes at the bottom then we put the all to the top.
Yes, would solve some complaints. With current code, adding a user option to "force on top" is a dozen lines. I can handle it too. :)
A possibility could be to only embed the task dialog into a scroll area and make sure that the button box is always visible.
This one is a bit more work but could be implemented (eventually as option) too. If we go for this, this would be good to offer the task dialogs a "fixed tray" just below the buttons (Sketcher could place here solver messages for example).
I am not sure if this is an advantage. If the buttons are visible but not the task dialog the user doesn't see what he accepts/rejects.
No problem. It's possible to disable buttons when task panel is hidden. In such a case, clicking on the button box could bring user back to task panel (and so re-enable buttons).
But here we already are in the details. ;)
Another issue that should be considered:
Currently the combo view has two tabs and there were times when it had three. So, it's good possible that in the future there will be more tabs again. And since the Check geometry dialog was mentioned it has four buttons. So, if now the buttons are added to the tab bar it can happen that the whole combo view takes a lot of extra width in order to show everything.
If buttons are only displaying their icons (no text) I think it should be OK. Nothing sure though.
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adrianinsaval
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by adrianinsaval »

openBrain wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 10:37 am So, if my rationale is correct, your point of view actually is "I don't care as long as it is an option"
I can't speak for zolko but seeing as the panel is available without tabs I don't think this is a good idea, because all "consistency" this could give goes to the trash once you have separate panels or you open a dialog that doesn't use the taks panel (for example clip plane). I'm all for smaller buttons but moving them to a tab area does not seem right to me.

Instead I think what would be best is to make all task dialog be a inside a scroll area bellow the ok/cancel/close buttons so that these buttons are fixed and always visible.

Also putting all icons on the top side would be a good thing as users get used to look for the buttons there. Off the top of my head what remains with bottom buttons are the clip plane, persistent cut, placement and geometry check dialogs. See https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/pull/8826
Would be a good idea to make a github issue to track all dialogs that have bottom buttons.
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adrianinsaval
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by adrianinsaval »

sorry seems I had missed some responses before
openBrain wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 11:18 am Yes, would solve some complaints. With current code, adding a user option to "force on top" is a dozen lines. I can handle it too. :)
do we need an option for this? I think it's ok to just make all dialogs have buttons on top. Internal consistency is what is important. Who would realistically actually use such an option?
This one is a bit more work but could be implemented (eventually as option) too. If we go for this, this would be good to offer the task dialogs a "fixed tray" just below the buttons (Sketcher could place here solver messages for example).
this looks like the best idea for me, but again do we really need an option? who realistically wants the ok button to disappear and have to scroll up and down?
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Re: [Opinion] Alternative button box for task dialog

Post by openBrain »

adrianinsaval wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 2:46 pm do we need an option for this? I think it's ok to just make all dialogs have buttons on top. Internal consistency is what is important. Who would realistically actually use such an option?
[...]
this looks like the best idea for me, but again do we really need an option? who realistically wants the ok button to disappear and have to scroll up and down?
Options are a good way to move forward as generally nobody will fight against something different but optional. :)
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