Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

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thomas-neemann
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by thomas-neemann »

saso wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 1:50 pm ....
I have nothing to complain about in freecad. i offer my workflow for free on youtube or as a web seminar. anyone who wants to can do it that way
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

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Can a mod please lock this thread?
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wandererfan
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by wandererfan »

saso wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 1:36 pm There are some well standardized ways how to do parametric cad and FreeCAD is just refusing to follow this.
...
clear methodologies, compatibility and standardization are key in the industry.
I also did not take this as trolling, but as frustration. AFAICT, FC does not enforce anything in the way of standard approaches to modelling. It would make everybody's life easier if it did.

That said, I can't write code to implement a fix for "FreeCAD sucks" or "the UI is no good". Not being a mechanical design engineer, I don't know the "standardized ways how to do parametric cad".

Traditionally, the business process (in this case "doing parametric cad") is articulated before the code is written. Maybe this was done for FreeCAD somewhere, but I've never seen it. Maybe it is blindingly obvious and I just don't see it.

If the process isn't documented, you get what we have now - a bunch of point solutions to specific problems.
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by saso »

thomas-neemann wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 2:08 pm
saso wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 1:50 pm ....
I have nothing to complain about in freecad. i offer my workflow for free on youtube or as a web seminar. anyone who wants to can do it that way
Look, I understand that I sound overly critical, I am actually very much in support for FC but it is just frustrating, for years we are arguing about the same things... And I have seat down with a few people like Notuseful, that had the genuine interest to evaluate FC and possibly start to use it, but when we go over a few thing behind the computer, they look at me and all I can really say is, yes I know, it is a bit of a mess. And when we then discuss how it could be improved we agree on many things, but when they ask why this is not done, all I can say is that there just seem to be no interest.
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by thomas-neemann »

wandererfan wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 2:18 pm ...
I also programmed a 3D system in the 80s. it had the same logic as freecad. I find it very intuitive. I find inventor, catia, solidworks etc illogical and complicated. don't be fooled. freecad is easy and fast when you want it. it is fantastic, sensational...
Gruß Dipl.-Ing. (FH) Thomas Neemann

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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by saso »

wandererfan wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 2:18 pm AFAICT, FC does not enforce anything in the way of standard approaches to modelling. It would make everybody's life easier if it did.
True, and personally I am actually supporting the idea that FC should allow for different modeling methods, but there is the difference in allowing and properly supporting different methods and having a method that does a bit of everything but nothing really properly. If thomas-neemann like his more direct approach, good he should have it, if york is developing around bim/ifc methodology, good he should do that, but when people that would like to have a workflow compatible with parametric cad systems like inventor, solidwroks, catia, creo,... the answer is no we don't have to do that.
wandererfan wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 2:18 pm That said, I can't write code to implement a fix for "FreeCAD sucks" or "the UI is no good". Not being a mechanical design engineer, I don't know the "standardized ways how to do parametric cad".

Traditionally, the business process (in this case "doing parametric cad") is articulated before the code is written. Maybe this was done for FreeCAD somewhere, but I've never seen it. Maybe it is blindingly obvious and I just don't see it.

If the process isn't documented, you get what we have now - a bunch of point solutions to specific problems.
Yes, I fully agree with you on that, but how much of suggestions from people like Zolko, freecad-heini-1, drmacro, me,... (I am sorry there a for sure a few more, that have more then shown over the time that they understand something from cad), has been directly acknowledged in to the core development, every time we fight even for the smallest change. For Assembly there are now again this useless discussions around solvers and constraints, this is not assembly, first one has to start to walk, before running and flying, a proper part/assembly tree structure is key. Yes Zolko understands this, he did not do much in development for Asm4, mostly just put a proper structure around the existing part and datum elements... I think we have great developers that I respect a lot, but indeed they seem to mostly prefer to work on their own or are listening to the wrong people.
Last edited by saso on Sat Mar 25, 2023 3:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by saso »

thomas-neemann wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 2:30 pm I also programmed a 3D system in the 80s. it had the same logic as freecad. I find it very intuitive. I find inventor, catia, solidworks etc illogical and complicated. don't be fooled. freecad is easy and fast when you want it. it is fantastic, sensational...
Yes thomas it si great that you are able to use it the way you want and I don't want to change it in a way where you would not be able to do it anymore, but not everyone wants such a workflow and by positioning this as the absolut method for FC, you are actually giving a big meddle finger to everyone else that has a different need for something more standardized and comparable to inventor, catia, solidworks etc
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by wmayer »

saso wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 1:36 pm There are some well standardized ways how to do parametric cad and FreeCAD is just refusing to follow this. There are some very knowledgeable users on cad methodologies in such companies and universities and as in the case with Notuseful when they take a look at FreeCAD they can just say WTF?! It does not matter how useful or fast it is to some existing users, clear methodologies, compatibility and standardization are key in the industry.
I very regularly see postings like this but the criticisms are always too general and too vague. Most of time the result of such threads is zero because either some other experienced CAD users say something different or a flame war starts where emotions then dominate the discussion instead of any facts.

I guess your criticism is mainly about the PartDesign workbench because that's the central part of FreeCAD. As you may know it was around 10 years ago when a few developers with some CAD background (IIRC JRiegel, DeepSOIC, Jan Rheinländer, ickby and a few more) sit down, formulated the rules and behaviour of the PartDesignNext workbench and implemented them accordingly. The result is the PartDesign workbench as we have it now.

So, in how far were they all wrong? And what are the functions that don't adhere to the industry standards and methodologies?
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by thomas-neemann »

wmayer wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:15 pm .... a flame war starts where emotions then dominate the discussion instead of any facts.
...
+1
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Re: Is Freecad a social coding project or a design software ?

Post by thschrader »

Notuseful wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 12:19 pm ...
Iam evaluating freecad to pursue a suggestion if our company should donate to freecad project instead of paying substantial licensing fees for inventor.

Evaluation closed.
Good Day Sir!

At the moment I am trying exactly the same process.
Get cash from my company to fund FC and bluecfdcore an Fluidx3D.
Some names...

The first question I got back was:
"Can we get the rights of the software?"
"How much does ist cost?"

What should be my answer?

@Werner:
Herr Riegel hat sich wohl kaum vorstellen können das FC soweit kommt.
Aber genau das ist geschehen.

Mr. Riegel could hardly have imagined that FC would get this far.
But that is exactly what happened.
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