Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

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chrisb
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by chrisb »

andremiv wrote: Sat Jan 22, 2022 11:57 pm I think if Freecad wants to evolve for the good, it has to completely abondon the OCC kernel and develop an API of its own from scratch.
This has indeed been discussed before but was seen to be too huge a task. But as every big task can start small, just start it! Make a pull request! A geometric kernel completely under control of FreeCAD could be wonderful and you may find others to support such development.
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by andremiv »

For sure it is a huge task, where is the US budget for freecad ? We need full time programmers plus internships, students etc.. I personnaly don't have time/money to do it

I will release my globoid generator + insta viewver for the community for free soon and maybe an indexed point stl csg small API in C/glsl but that's it

André Miville
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chrisb
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by chrisb »

andremiv wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:33 am For sure it is a huge task, where is the US budget for freecad ? We need full time programmers plus internships, students etc.. I personnaly don't have time/money to do it
So why do you go on and on with this topic? Who do you think should start with this, if not someone being so vivid for a change as you?
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by Kunda1 »

I'm still waiting for a mea culpa and a thread topic change. :lol:
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by andremiv »

I don't go on and on, there are has been progression, I leveled up my frustration since the first post, Now I know better the culprits. but who's cares I guess, it won't change anything if nobody has the will to start. I guess I will start first and try to hype devs with C script point Generators. I will release my STL globoid generator (where you can't work with it because no CAD can work with output files proprely) in less than 3 weeks.
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Re: [SOLVED] Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by Kunda1 »

OK, we look forward to your proof of concept.
andremiv wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:27 pm Now I know better the culprits. but who's cares I guess, it won't change anything if nobody has the will to start.

Tip: we care. It's our time we've spent responding to you. next time, please don't come in 'guns blazing' with strong opinions that are not informed. You'll get a lot farther asking about the 'culprits' than superficially judging and throwing your opinions around saying this programming language is better than that.
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Re: Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by chrisb »

andremiv wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:27 pm but who's cares I guess, it won't change anything if nobody has the will to start. I guess I will start first and try to hype devs with C script point Generators. I will release my STL globoid generator (where you can't work with it because no CAD can work with output files proprely) in less than 3 weeks.
Whereever you start, it is a start :D .
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Re: [SOLVED] Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by onekk »

andremiv wrote: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:33 am
Short answer: Just use one other free cad program that are available around.

If there is not you could even program one yourself.

I have enconutered in some programmer's forum this motto.

"Stop complainig, start coding"

Side note OCCT documentation is specifying exactly what is contained in a brep file. (now I'm on mobile so no link, but i could integrate this post later with a proper link)

https://dev.opencascade.org/doc/occt-7. ... ormat.html


Speaking of AI Artificial is ok but naming Intelligence a bunch of algorithm made by lines if program made by humans, don't resemble the definition of Intelligence.

You couldn't program intuition and other thing that's made real intelligence. The level of abstraction needed to guess a law from an apparent caos is not programmable yet.

Application of AI are simply "surpassing" the precision that an "average oanel if expert" could infere from the data supplied (see MYCIN on wikipedia, snd you will see that AI was programmed ling tome ago for diagnostic purpouse and reporpoused as general AI).

goid luck eith something different from basic english to guess the real content if a phrase on a decent articulated language where eird position don't matter)

We italians are laughing almost everytime some test is machine translated, and I think also Spanish and French People too. Our language can say the same thing using many ways, but it is true also fir English.

Result of 3+2

Sum 3 and 2 (or Sum three and two)

Calculate 2 + 3 ( calculate the sum if three plus two)

are telling same thing.

I was pleaed to see how much lines if code will be necessary to parse all this costruction (leave a part mire complex thing like derivative or integrals snd their geometric equivalences.)


Apoarently you don't guess the bug difference between a triangulated mesh and a a BREP (generic term for Boundary Representation), there us also CSG.

see:
https://dev.opencascade.org/doc/occt-7. ... _mesh.html

This also explain some theory behind the two parameter that control the behaviour of the Coin3D visualization ()

A part for the Viusualization part that is managed in a different way in FreeCAD, usually OCCT guide is a good reading for who are trying to code on FreeCAD. many concepts are simply translated from OCCT to FreeCAD some other have a different level of abstraction, but as the 3d engine is OCCT final solid obey to OCCT rules.

Usually Caveats that are advised on OCCT Guides, could be used alsso in FreeCAD.

This is a very interesting reading.

https://dev.opencascade.org/doc/occt-7. ... algos.html

https://dev.opencascade.org/doc/occt-7. ... t_fcug_4_3

but STL is only a Mesh and don't have a concept about how a face is generated, You could define a cylinder with radius and height (provided you costruct it on XY and height is in Z), change only a dimension and the brep file will not change (only sone number are affected)

but number of triangles in a STL mesh will vary if you change only height and make it 10 instead of 2.

Try maybe BRLCAD it's CAD engine is not OCCT and his Open Source too.

EDIT: I've read some of your post and it seems you have modified your opinion.

Hope it will help you in some manner.

Regards

Carlo D.
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Re: [SOLVED] Freecad fails to be serious CAD because of poor language choice

Post by andremiv »

Ok Onekk you got me thinking some more stop me when I am wrong.

Let's say I have two objects defined by two mathematical representations with their given parametrization, let's say they are stored in a equivalent of OCCT brep file format, what I understand from
https://dev.opencascade.org/doc/occt-7. ... algos.html

is that the OCCT intersectors algo breaks mathematical representation, they only compute within a tolerance points close enough.
Did I understand correctly their algos because once again I think this is awful documentation ?

I though they would kind of preserved the mathematical representation though if thing it is mathematically impossible in the general case
For example, intersection of two Surfaces :

Surface 1: parametrized by a,b : X(a,b) Y(a,b) Z(a,b)
Surface 2: parametrized by c,d : X(c,d) Y(c,d) Z(c,d)

So the intersection is three constraints :
X(a,b) = X(c,d)
Y(a,b) = Y(c,d)
Z(a,b) = Z(c,d)

If we have a one point solution (a Zmax for instance via Lagrange multipliers), we could find the others with a tangeant Vector that would give the next point.

Petsc provides lots of good and fast algos to solve these problems :
https://petsc.org/release/overview/nonl ... lve_table/

If I understand right, the OCCT doesn't solve any system at all. Can someone please confirm. Sorry awful documentation, can't figure it out properly.

Regards

Miville André
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